tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post3359255411236038343..comments2024-01-23T02:32:28.567-08:00Comments on Darwin's God: The Unauthorized Answers to Jerry Coyne’s BlogUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger58125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-48241531348882984402018-04-21T09:04:20.904-07:002018-04-21T09:04:20.904-07:00Yes, exactly !!Yes, exactly !!Cornelius Hunterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12283098537456505707noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-41823060291298010872018-04-19T03:29:05.640-07:002018-04-19T03:29:05.640-07:00I guess Coyne and al. need a safe space to protect...I guess Coyne and al. need a safe space to protect themselves from the harsh realities of life. An all to common example of stunted intellectual growth in our cowardly society.Peter Wadeckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00396555091658593382noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-28708828619331327162018-04-16T20:41:41.306-07:002018-04-16T20:41:41.306-07:00I don’t need to be Jesus to recognize important tr...I don’t need to be Jesus to recognize important truth from the Bible, just His follower. I’m only sharing it, of course you have the freedom to do with it what you want.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14818404010710070781noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-91671724975583310562018-04-16T20:36:08.932-07:002018-04-16T20:36:08.932-07:00Unless you can walk on water and heal the blind an...Unless you can walk on water and heal the blind and the paralyzed, don't preach to me, jackass.Rebel Sciencehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11762287159937757216noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-38256060179669944772018-04-16T14:21:18.432-07:002018-04-16T14:21:18.432-07:00Oh, Louis, your antics are highly entertaining, bu...Oh, Louis, your antics are highly entertaining, but yet terribly sad. After I had a good laugh realizing that you were completely unaware of my sarcasm, I began to fervently hope you don't reveal to anyone (outside of your internet ramblings) that you are a Christian. John 13:35 (NIV) reads "By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another."Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14818404010710070781noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-65970386579727104632018-04-16T13:34:53.514-07:002018-04-16T13:34:53.514-07:00I'm feeling very lucky that I don't worshi...<i>I'm feeling very lucky that I don't worship dirt, Louis.</i><br /><br />You're one of the worst dirt worshippers of them all, pretending to believe in God when, in fact, you're an enemy of God.<br /><br /><i>Otherwise, I might be very sad and hurt by your comments.</i><br /><br />This is why I posted it. It's intended to make people like you feel like idiots and jackasses.<br /><br />ahahahaha...AHAHAHAHA...ahahahaha...Rebel Sciencehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11762287159937757216noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-68368289289472402422018-04-15T20:42:09.398-07:002018-04-15T20:42:09.398-07:00I'm feeling very lucky that I don't worshi...I'm feeling very lucky that I don't worship dirt, Louis. Otherwise, I might be very sad and hurt by your comments.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14818404010710070781noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-36166366886511896592018-04-15T20:40:52.169-07:002018-04-15T20:40:52.169-07:00Cornelius, I gave several examples of observable f...Cornelius, I gave several examples of observable facts that support the theory of evolution. Instead of supplying evidence to the contrary, your response is a weak, and inapplicable sports metaphor. I continue to ask you for evidence to support your metaphor and you finally supply some rather interesting articles. The problem is that the authors aren't saying the same thing that you are saying - that directed adaptation is inconsistent with the theory of evolution. I ask you what you see in the data that they missed and (to keep up the sports metaphors), you "cry foul", rather than actually addressing my question. Why do you assume that new discoveries about how evolution works somehow invalidate the basic concepts - survival of the fittest brought about by genetic change.<br /><br />I'd still love to see how your tool of science gives you a better hypothesis than evolution.<br /><br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14818404010710070781noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-91154584703142858102018-04-15T19:13:36.221-07:002018-04-15T19:13:36.221-07:00I see no value in arguing with dirt worshippers. T...I see no value in arguing with dirt worshippers. They deserve nothing but insults and contempt. They deserve to be publicly shamed and ridiculed. Their opinions are worthless and a waste of time.Rebel Sciencehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11762287159937757216noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-58520829192797453302018-04-15T18:33:18.667-07:002018-04-15T18:33:18.667-07:00Well the goalposts keep on moving. First it was th...Well the goalposts keep on moving. First it was that there is all kinds of evidence for evolution, including antibiotic resistance in bacteria. Then it was skepticism of directed adaptation. Now it is, evolutionists haven't changed their mind. Well I have news for you, they aren't going to change their mind. Epicureanism has been around since antiquity--today's scientific problems are no match for it. The quotes you provided are nothing more than bare assertions of belief. Directed adaptation was opposed until it could no longer be denied, and so now suddenly is yet another mechanism and evidence of evolution, even though the underlying problem demolishes evolution. There was a reason why it was opposed. It doesn't work, as I have explained. You obviously want evolution to be true, to the point of bare assertions. My only argument, and the only tool I have, is the science. But that never works with evolutionists.Cornelius Hunterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12283098537456505707noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-20311691942680841992018-04-15T16:50:46.196-07:002018-04-15T16:50:46.196-07:00From the Aldana reference you listed:
"With ...From the Aldana reference you listed:<br /><br />"With the advent of systems biology and its toolsets, integrative models that combine experimentally known features with computational simulations have significantly improved our understanding of the emergence and evolution of the adaptive-resistant phenotype."<br /><br />The Barbara Write article you referenced is titled "A Biochemical Mechanism for Nonrandom Mutations and Evolution".<br /><br />In the second sentence of the abstract, the Gerard Wright article reads "The origin of the genes associated with this resistance is of significant importance to our understanding of the evolution and dissemination of antibiotic resistance in pathogens."<br /><br />I feel confident I could find similar remarks in the others, but I have other things to get done today.<br /><br />I do intend to look at the science further, but the authors apparently didn't find anything contrary to evolution. In these articles, what do you think is present that the authors missed and that contradicts evolution?<br /><br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14818404010710070781noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-1418631935916884772018-04-15T16:23:20.902-07:002018-04-15T16:23:20.902-07:00No, it doesn't work that way. You need to take...No, it doesn't work that way. You need to take a look at the science.Cornelius Hunterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12283098537456505707noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-41651231727322692192018-04-15T14:47:57.838-07:002018-04-15T14:47:57.838-07:00Ok, so naive bacterial population meets an antibio...Ok, so naive bacterial population meets an antibiotic for the first time. The antibiotic kills virtually the entire population, but a few cells survive. The survival could be because of:<br /><br />1) Genetic drift within the population that allowed a small number of cells to be able to survive the challenge of the antibiotic<br /><br />or<br /><br />2) The population enters some type of SOS response after the challenge of the antibiotic and a small number are able to survive the challenge.<br /><br />Does one of these possibilities provide a significant challenge to the basic concept of evolution (survival of the fittest)? I would say no.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14818404010710070781noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-27271741214471678722018-04-15T14:30:52.391-07:002018-04-15T14:30:52.391-07:00Directed adaptation |= adaptation, per se. Directe...Directed adaptation |= adaptation, per se. Directed adaptation is completely different--it is Lamarckian. Cornelius Hunterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12283098537456505707noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-18849307530295204552018-04-15T14:03:57.626-07:002018-04-15T14:03:57.626-07:00Adaptation, along with common descent, natural sel...<i>Adaptation, along with common descent, natural selection, gradualism, random mutations, punctuated equilibrium, clado genesis, etc., is a sub hypothesis, or explanation, of how evolution works.</i><br /><br />I would agree with this. That's why I'm confused by the comment earlier that directed adaptation is anathema to evolutionists.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14818404010710070781noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-10945075579310696952018-04-15T12:53:03.544-07:002018-04-15T12:53:03.544-07:00I’m hoping you can provide is evidence that shows ...<i>I’m hoping you can provide is evidence that shows that adaptation is inconsistent with evolution.</i><br /><br />Adaptation, along with common descent, natural selection, gradualism, random mutations, punctuated equilibrium, clado genesis, etc., is a sub hypothesis, or explanation, of how evolution works.Cornelius Hunterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12283098537456505707noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-2087648698611099322018-04-15T12:33:27.364-07:002018-04-15T12:33:27.364-07:00Dr. Hunter, is this really how Darwinists reason? ...Dr. Hunter, is this really how Darwinists reason? Adaptation must be shown to be consistent with evolution. But its not. Instead adaptation is assumed to be consistent with evolution. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16947837920228499944noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-12730191152459550942018-04-14T21:47:57.976-07:002018-04-14T21:47:57.976-07:00You supplied some great evidence. Perhaps I was no...You supplied some great evidence. Perhaps I was not specific enough, but what I’m hoping you can provide is evidence that shows that adaptation is inconsistent with evolution. You still have not supplied any of that.<br /><br />I’m also hoping you will at some point provide evidence that you feel supports a better hypothesis than evolution.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14818404010710070781noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-9804989115451213242018-04-14T08:11:30.411-07:002018-04-14T08:11:30.411-07:00I’m still unclear on why this would be evidence ag...<i>I’m still unclear on why this would be evidence against evolution. If populations circumnavigate environmental barriers either by the presence of individuals in the gene pool able to avoid the barrier or by a more direct response to the barrier, it appears as though the result is the same - the population adapts to the barrier with change over time.</i><br /><br />I of course had no illusions that the empirical facts would make any difference. Evolutionists can at one moment be demanding evidence for directed adaptation, and then in the next, when provided with the evidence, simply accommodate it into their theory. This has occurred repeatedly since Darwin. There is no empirical content, because this never was about the science in the first place. Evolution is a religious theory which is willing to contort the science in whatever way is required.Cornelius Hunterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12283098537456505707noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-52333401169929571692018-04-14T06:17:49.349-07:002018-04-14T06:17:49.349-07:00Cornelius, thank you for the material you have pos...Cornelius, thank you for the material you have posted. You’ve highlighted some very interesting research and I will certainly check into it. I’m still unclear on why this would be evidence against evolution. If populations circumnavigate environmental barriers either by the presence of individuals in the gene pool able to avoid the barrier or by a more direct response to the barrier, it appears as though the result is the same - the population adapts to the barrier with change over time.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14818404010710070781noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-4001974109330470312018-04-13T22:36:35.064-07:002018-04-13T22:36:35.064-07:00Continued …
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/art...Continued …<br /><br /><br />https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4363326/<br /><br />Adaptive resistance in bacteria is observed after subjecting a population to gradual increments of antibiotic concentration. Regardless of the level of resistance reached through this process, (which can be very high), the resistance disappears after a few generations in the absence of antibiotic. Previous studies have independently identified epigenetic inheritance and phenotypic heterogeneity as important components involved in the emergence of adaptive resistance [1, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, 11], but their role has never been evaluated quantitatively. Additionally, the molecular origin of reversibility observed in adaptive resistance has remained unclear. …<br /><br />Our model provides an explanation for the emergence of adaptive resistance based on the cost and benefit of the biological characteristics of an efflux pump system. It does not only predict the behavior of populations subjected to different antibiotic shocks and at different time, but also a number of different phenomena observed experimentally in bacterial populations, such as phenotypic reversibility, genetic assimilation, and even the survival rates of populations that have been pre-induced with non-lethal antibiotic concentrations.<br /><br /><br />https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27103502<br /><br />Adaptive resistance to antibiotics in bacteria: a systems biology perspective<br /><br /><br />https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC94481/<br /><br />This minireview will describe mechanisms of mutation that are not random and can accelerate the process of evolution in specific directions. The existence of such mechanisms has been predicted by mathematicians who argue that, if every mutation were really random and had to be tested against the environment for selection or rejection, there would not have been enough time to evolve the extremely complex biochemical networks and regulatory mechanisms found in organisms today.<br /><br />This minireview suggests that sensitive, directed feedback mechanisms initiated by different kinds of stress might facilitate and accelerate the adaptation of organisms to new environments.<br /><br /><br /><br />http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0034953<br /><br />We report that, like surface microbes, these bacteria were highly resistant to antibiotics; some strains were resistant to 14 different commercially available antibiotics. … This supports a growing understanding that antibiotic resistance is natural, ancient, and hard wired in the microbial pangenome.<br /><br />http://healthland.time.com/2012/04/12/drug-resistant-bacteria-discovered-in-4-million-year-old-cave/<br /><br />The pristine samples of bacteria taken from the cave revealed that the bugs are not infectious to humans but can fend off several types of antibiotics, including newer synthetic drugs.<br /><br /><br />https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20811567<br /><br />This study deals with yeast.<br /><br />Since we show that the adaptive state was gained only after the exposure to glucose and by numerous cells simultaneously, this heritable adaptation must have been induced in individual cells by this environment. This study, therefore, details a process that is different from the fundamental common view of adaptation. Here adaptation seems not to rely on random and rare genetic variability that accumulated independently from the selection agent.<br /><br />The adaptation relied on individual cells that switched into an adapted state and, thus, the adaptation was due to a response of many individual cells to the change in environment and not due to selection of rare advantageous phenotypes.Cornelius Hunterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12283098537456505707noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-14500092706964176542018-04-13T22:35:26.966-07:002018-04-13T22:35:26.966-07:00Are you familiar with the work of Luria and Delbrü...<i>Are you familiar with the work of Luria and Delbrück?</i><br /><br />A lot has happened since 1943, such as the discovery of directed adaptation which contradicted Luria and Delbruck, and evolutionists expectations in general. See below for the evidence which you requested (URLs followed by quotes):<br /><br /><br />https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2929248/<br /><br />We usually think of spontaneous mutations as the result of replication errors made while cells are growing exponentially. That mutations do arise during cell proliferation and without regard to selection was, of course, shown by Luria and Delbrück (1943). Several years ago, John Cairns and his collaborators (Cairns et al. 1988) demonstrated that mutations can also arise in nonproliferating cells when they are subjected to a nonlethal selection. These experiments extended earlier observations made by Francis Ryan (Ryan 1955; Ryan et al. 1961) and James Shapiro (Shapiro 1984).<br /><br />Luria and Delbrück’s proof that mutations arise at random in a growing population was based on large fluctuations in mutant numbers among parallel cultures of bacteria. These large fluctuations occur because clones of different sizes are produced by mutants that appear at different points during the growth of the cultures. Cairns et al. (1988) used the absence of large fluctuations in mutant numbers among parallel cultures to demonstrate that mutations also arise after selection had been imposed. Because on solid selective medium each mutant produces a colony of progeny cells, and so is counted as one, the distribution of mutant numbers is Poisson with a variation equal to its mean. Luria and Delbrück could not have seen this Poisson component; the selections they used were lethal, so no mutants could have arisen after selection was imposed, as Delbrück himself pointed out at the 1946 Cold Spring Harbor Symposium (see Lwoff 1946, p. 154).<br /><br />Although the occurrence of mutations in nonproliferating cells is an interesting and potentially important phenomenon, what was startling about the results of Cairns et al. (1988) was that mutations appeared to be “directed” by the selective conditions; i.e., while selected mutations were accumulating, deleterious or neutral mutations were not. As Cairns put it “populations of bacteria, in stationary phase, have some way of producing (or selectively retaining) only the most appropriate mutations” (Cairns et al. 1988). Some of the more dramatic cases of “directed” mutation have now been shown to have other causes, so at this point we are left with rather few examples of apparent directedness that are still unexplained (for review, see Foster 1999b). The phenomenon has come to be called “adaptive mutation” by which is meant a process that during nonlethal selection produces mutations that relieve the selected pressure, whether or not other nonselected mutations are also occurring (Foster 1999b).<br /><br />Continued …Cornelius Hunterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12283098537456505707noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-70419983570306250042018-04-13T20:37:29.248-07:002018-04-13T20:37:29.248-07:00Are you familiar with the work of Luria and Delbrü...Are you familiar with the work of Luria and Delbrück?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14818404010710070781noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-31231327323500307382018-04-13T20:24:50.309-07:002018-04-13T20:24:50.309-07:00I’ll wait for evidence, if any is forthcoming, bef...I’ll wait for evidence, if any is forthcoming, before responding in any significant detail.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14818404010710070781noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-51789354244145200302018-04-13T20:16:28.382-07:002018-04-13T20:16:28.382-07:00Antibiotic resistance in bacteria has been shown r...Antibiotic resistance in bacteria has been shown repeatedly to be a consequence of directed adaptation, an anathema to evolutionists.Cornelius Hunterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12283098537456505707noreply@blogger.com