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All extant forms are descended from a pentadactyl ancestor. Zachrielhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16081260898264733380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-13730766539981303162015-06-04T16:45:53.283-07:002015-06-04T16:45:53.283-07:00Aaron:
Thank you for your comments.
I fail to ...Aaron:<br /><br />Thank you for your comments. <br /><br /><br /><i>I fail to see why this is some crushing blow to common decent.</i><br /><br />The site makes no such claim. For the intent and scope of the site, as well as a FAQ section, please see the Introduction.<br /><br /><br /><i>this section is bafflingly and undoubtedly deliberately a distortion</i><br /><br />There is no deliberate distortion on the site.<br /><br /><br /><i>For example, was the “certainty” that must be reversed according to Gould? That pentadactyly is homologous in tetrapods or that pentadactyly was the basal condition? The answer is only a sentence or two past the part you quote.</i><br /><br />As above, you seem to be projecting a theme that is not there. The Gould quote illustrates that the prediction that the tetrapod pentadactyl pattern should fall into a common descent pattern is false. The rest of the essay is a good illustration of that fact.<br /><br /><br /><i>where do Siler and Brown (2011) make the claim that pentadactyly evolved “independently”?</i><br /><br />Evolutionists have several candidate mechanisms to explain the observed digit structure pattern. Independent evolution is one of them, but that is beside the point. How the pattern is explained, and how many mechanisms are employed, doesn’t change the fact that the prediction was falsified. In fact, a great variety of patterns can be explained.<br /><br /><br /><br /><i> You should know that legless skinks develop pentadactyl limb buds as embryos, but these do not develop and are reabsorbed. When limbs re-evolve they are not originating from scratch …</i><br /><br />Again, yes, different mechanisms are available to evolutionists. That doesn’t change the fact that the prediction was falsified. We added (Brown, 2012) and edited the text to help avoid this confusion in the future.<br /><br />Good comments on embryology, that one is under construction. Thank you again.Cornelius Hunterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12283098537456505707noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-16822625149380871662015-06-04T11:08:22.300-07:002015-06-04T11:08:22.300-07:00Okay, I took a look at the Darwin’s Predictions pa...Okay, I took a look at the Darwin’s Predictions page. Just a few comments….<br />“Embryology and Common Decent”<br />I would highly recommend that you do a better literature search before making bold claims about development pathways. Especially when your source is 45 years old. When de Beer described the lens development in Rana (actually Rana and Pelophylax) species he was apparently unaware of any research in the area since Spemann (1901). Especially research in 1956 that showed that Spemann’s results were incorrect for a number of reasons, the most important being that larval rearing temperature was the critical difference, not the presence or absence of the optic cup (Swindell et. al, 2008).<br />About pepperpot formation in Solanum. First of all, I cannot at all fathom why you refer to anther formation as “embryonic development”. I hope you understand that plant embryos do not produce flower structures. Regardless, I fail to see why this is some crushing blow to common decent. The difference between the two structures is the method by which the anthers are held together. Tomatoes use hairs to mechanically hold the anthers in the pepperpot formation, while bittersweets use a sticky glue. Two solutions to the same ‘problem’ that are non-homologous. This doesn’t mean that the anthers (or any other flower part) are considered non-homologous. Both species rely on bees using “buzz-pollination” and the pepperpot anther arrangement optimizes this. A suitable analogy would be the wings of birds and bats. Both are derived from a homologous structure (the forearm) but differ in the specific ‘solution’ to volancy. <br />“The Pentadactyl Pattern and Common Decent”<br />Unlike the previous section in which it is possible you simply misunderstood the literature, this section is bafflingly and undoubtedly deliberately a distortion. For example, was the “certainty” that must be reversed according to Gould? That pentadactyly is homologous in tetrapods or that pentadactyly was the basal condition? The answer is only a sentence or two past the part you quote. <br />About those skinks you discuss – where do Siler and Brown (2011) make the claim that pentadactyly evolved “independently”? You should know that legless skinks develop pentadactyl limb buds as embryos, but these do not develop and are reabsorbed. When limbs re-evolve they are not originating from scratch, the factors inhibiting expression are turned off such that the limbs follow the ancestral pattern of development. The surprise was that toolkit to form a limb (and specifically a pentadactyl limb) remained intact despite non-expression. My best guess on the why of this is that the cascade involved in limb formation also regulates other functions and so therefore is maintained despite inhibition.<br />Aaron Baldwinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13416626341752782139noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-17596423186094864322015-05-30T12:41:14.934-07:002015-05-30T12:41:14.934-07:00Calamity:
Mr Hunter answer is comical. You are an...Calamity:<br /><br /><i>Mr Hunter answer is comical. You are answering my "you guys are in denial" by a childish "your denial is incredible".<br /><br />You are saying that Nobel laureate and textbooks are making false statements. In my opinion this it not true, as i explained in my previous post.</i><br /><br />So when I explain that you seem to be in denial when you refuse to accept established science, then I am guilty of being childish, but when you say I am in denial for no reason, that is a cogent observation.Cornelius Hunterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12283098537456505707noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-80140782472427248432015-05-29T12:28:11.912-07:002015-05-29T12:28:11.912-07:00Unguided evolution cannot explain anything beyond ...Unguided evolution cannot explain anything beyond one gene, one protein. And it has to be given that to start with.Joe Ghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08305194278121208230noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-16511059248975135782015-05-29T12:26:53.425-07:002015-05-29T12:26:53.425-07:00Intelligent Design is not anti-evolution. Evolutio...Intelligent Design is not anti-evolution. Evolutionary and genetic algorithms demonstrate the power of intelligent design evolution.<br /><br />Common design tells us that the genetic code, or at least it's chemical embodiment, must be shared by nearly all organisms, if not all. Unguided evolution cannot account for the genetic code nor DNA. So that would be an issue for you to solve.Joe Ghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08305194278121208230noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3855268335402896473.post-33495328459376906692015-05-29T11:37:38.242-07:002015-05-29T11:37:38.242-07:00Read what Professor James M. Tour says, who is one...Read what Professor James M. Tour says, who is one of the ten most cited chemists in the world.Here’s what he said when a student in the audience asked him about evolution:<br /><br /> … I will tell you as a scientist and a synthetic chemist: if anybody should be able to understand evolution, it is me, because I make molecules for a living, and I don’t just buy a kit, and mix this and mix this, and get that. I mean, ab initio, I make molecules. I understand how hard it is to make molecules. I understand that if I take Nature’s tool kit, it could be much easier, because all the tools are already there, and I just mix it in the proportions, and I do it under these conditions, but ab initio is very, very hard.<br /><br /> I don’t understand evolution, and I will confess that to you. Is that OK, for me to say, “I don’t understand this”? Is that all right? I know that there’s a lot of people out there that don’t understand anything about organic synthesis, but they understand evolution. I understand a lot about making molecules; I don’t understand evolution. And you would just say that, wow, I must be really unusual.<br /><br /> Let me tell you what goes on in the back rooms of science – with National Academy members, with Nobel Prize winners. I have sat with them, and when I get them alone, not in public – because it’s a scary thing, if you say what I just said – I say, “Do you understand all of this, where all of this came from, and how this happens?” Every time that I have sat with people who are synthetic chemists, who understand this, they go “Uh-uh. Nope.” These people are just so far off, on how to believe this stuff came together. I’ve sat with National Academy members, with Nobel Prize winners. Sometimes I will say, “Do you understand this?”And if they’re afraid to say “Yes,” they say nothing. They just stare at me, because they can’t sincerely do it. <br />If you understand evolution, I am fine with that. I’m not going to try to change you – not at all. In fact, I wish I had the understanding that you have. Now, I understand microevolution, I really do. We do this all the time in the lab. I understand this. But when you have speciation changes, when you have organs changing, when you have to have concerted lines of evolution, all happening in the same place and time – not just one line – concerted lines, all at the same place, all in the same environment … this is very hard to fathom.<br /><br />But about seven or eight years ago I posted on my Web site that I don’t understand. And I said, “I will buy lunch for anyone that will sit with me and explain to me evolution, and I won’t argue with you until I don’t understand something – I will ask you to clarify. But you can’t wave by and say, “This enzyme does that.” You’ve got to get down in the details of where molecules are built, for me. Nobody has come forward.PhillyMikehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09048456402828838092noreply@blogger.com